Orange County Shooters
News from the Orange County NY, NY State and the Nation of interest to gun owners and sportsmen
JANUARY 2006 Newsletter
7 Orange County Police Departments sign on to NYAGV's Assault weapons and ammo ban. 6 Orange County Police Departments sign on to NYAGV's Assault weapons and ammo ban.
2005 Pistol License applications for Orange County 2004 Pistol License applications for Orange County
Mater Class to hold their 8th Annual John Browning Combo Match Mater Class to hold their 8th Annual John Browning Combo Match
Orange County Trappers Annual Dinner Orange County Trappers Annual Dinner gets 230,000 hits in 2005 gets 230,000 hits in 2005
4th Annual Sportsmans Banquet at Calvary Baptist Church 4th Annual Sportsman’s Banquet at Calvary Baptist Church UPDATE: After Dinner Report & Pictures


Join us on March 14th for the Annual March on Albany
NYAGV dupes police departments to sign onto AWB NYAGV dupes police departments to sign onto AWB & Ammo Ban
New York Police Combat Association has new Blog New York Police Combat Association has new Blog, Announces 2006 Match Schedule
Anti-gun Bills in the Assembly Anti-gun Bills in the Assembly
NYSCC Interviews with Eliot Spitzer NYSCC Interview with Eliot Spitzer
NY CoBIS or NY CoBIS or "GUN DNA" end of year update and possible "HIT"
Where in the world is Andy Pelosi? Where in the world is Andy Pelosi?
Bill Hammond, Bill Hammond, "short of the mark.
NY City Justice, Rapist on parole who is arrested with 2 guns released on his own recognizance NY City Justice, Rapist on parole who is arrested with 2 guns released on his own recognizance
NY City Mayor to push for more gun control in Albany and Washington DC. NY City Mayor to push for more gun control in Albany and Washington DC.NY City Mayor to push for more gun control in Albany and Washington DC. With additional articles
Gov. Mario Pataki calls Gov. Mario Pataki calls "Extraordinary Session" to pass gun control laws that punish criminals


NSSF holds Wingshooting USA's Dream Hunts Sweepstakes NSSF holds Wingshooting USA's Dream Hunts Sweepstakes
Gunning For the World, By David Morton, January/February 2006, Once just a club for red-blooded American gun owners, the National Rifle Association has become a savvy global lobby. It presses for gun rights at the United Nations. It assists pro-gun campaigns from Sydney to São Paulo. And it has found that its message—loving freedom means loving guns—translates into almost every language. Gun Control: The Promotion of Denial, Written by Howard Nemerov, January 07, 2006 Have you ever asked yourself: Why, when evidence overwhelmingly shows gun banners are wrong, do they persist in making outrageous claims about law-abiding gun owners? There may finally be an answer, so read on.
A woman, a batterer and a gun, by Joan Ryan
Hollywood Lobbies U.N. on Gun Control Saturday, Jan. 21, 2006 NEW YORK CITY -- An international coalition of anti-gun groups called on Hollywood to convince a U.N. conference in New York to impose legally-binding United Nations controls over small arms and personal firearms.     Flanked by Hollywood director Andrew Niccol, advocates from ControlArms, SaferWorld, and the International Action Network on Small Arms, IANSA, hosted a cocktail party at the United Nations headquarters building Tuesday night, followed by a viewing of Niccol's 2005 film, "Lord of War." UK: "Farmer robbed - and police confiscate his shotgun" TWYFORD strawberry farmer Eric Jarnet is fuming after police confiscated his shotgun on his 70th birthday because they feared he might emulate Norfolk farmer Tony Martin.      Mr Martin became a national figure after the shotgun killing of a burglar at his farmhouse.     An exasperated Mr Jarnet publicly admitted he might "do a Martin" after raiders stole hundreds of yards of irrigation piping from his 25-acre Twyford Fruit Farm in London Road, effectively putting him out of business.     Moments after he made his remarks police arrived to seize his shotgun, for which he has a licence.

CoBIS or Gun "DNA" Watch

# OF CoBIS "Hits"
$19,666,666 +?


20 Jan, Fri,  


     Is it the weak drug laws in other states that cause the drug problems in NY? Is it the weak liquor sales laws in other states that cause DUI and DWI in NY? I could bring a truck load of handguns and machine guns into NY or NY City and if no criminal decided to buy a gun then I would have no one to sell the guns to.
      The real problem is that NY and NY City is EXPORTING its criminals and crime into the other states. It is the NY and NY City Criminal who goes to other states and talks other people into breaking Federal and local laws by buying guns for the criminal that is the problem. It is the NY and NY City criminal who buys illegal guns brought in from other states that is the problem. It is NY and NY City that has passed the laws that disarm the average law abiding citizen and forces them to buy handguns from the black market often paying less for an illegal gun than what they would pay to get a license that only last 3 years in NY City. What Sheldon Silver, Mayor Bloomberg and the other anti-gun forces want is for all of the other states to pass gun control laws like NY City has but unlike NY and NY City, most states trust their citizens and respect their citizens rights including their Second Amendment rights.
     The anti-gun forces complain that it is the weak gun laws in other states that is causing the gun problems in NY. What else do you expect from people when they cannot enforce NY law in NY? In case they forgot, each state gets to set their own laws and all of the states have to follow Federal law. Under Federal law each gun sold by a dealer has to have Federal approval in the form the NICS check and the dealers have many other laws and regulations they have to follow like not selling guns to "straw purchasers."
     It is a unforgivable for Sheldon Silver, Mayor Bloomberg and his anti-gun supporters to try to use the death of police officers to try to pass gun control laws that will end gun sales in NY and further restrict, penalize and criminalize the legal, law abiding gun owners in NY. Silver, Bloomberg and their anti-gun friends will not be happy until all guns are banned in NY and all states across the nation are forced to adopt NY's laws.
     Just remember that in NY what would be a legal gun in almost every other state is illegal here.

  • While many states require the person to be license to conceal carry, NY makes it illegal for anyone to even touch a handgun unless you first have a license with prior approval from the issuing authority that list each gun you own by make, model and serial number. That means that everyone in every other state who keeps a handgun in the home would have to go out and get a license that registers each gun they own. (People are not allowed to shoot handguns in handgun safety classes or hold a handgun when they go to the gun store or gun show to buy their first gun even after they have applied for a license.)
  • Some places, like NY City do not allow the same gun to be on more than one license so if you have a 22 cal., your wife or children have to get their own if you are not present.
  • Some NY counties limit the number of handgun you can own and one Judge only allows you to own 3 handguns. All perfectly legal according to NY courts.
  • Forget about teaching your children to shoot. In NY your children have to wait until their 18 birthday to even hold your handgun and they have to be 21 to get a license. (Except most places will not take the application until they are 21 and because it normally takes 4 to 6 month or more to get a license, they could almost be 22 before they get to have their own gun. Even people in the military are not exempt!)
  • A handgun license in most of the state can cost $140 or more and the only good thing is that they are good for a life time. Proposals to require a 5 year renewable license that the state charges $100 for and the counties can charge as much as they want, (how about $1,000 per gun per year,) have failed so far. NY City charges almost $500 for your first 3 year license and $340 for each renewal, ($140 for all long guns and many long guns are banned,) and those licenses are not even valid in the rest of the state.
  • NY City has many other rules and regulations and people have lost their handgun license because they failed to get prior approval from the Pistol Department when they sold a handgun listed on their license to an FFL. Your application has to be typed and you have to go to show them your handgun and serial number when you buy your gun and renew your license.
  • Many places place additional, NY Court approved "restrictions" on each license that tell you when, where and how you can carry, transport and have your handgun. Break the "restrictions" and you can loose your license and guns!

     Bloomingidoit Bloomberg has lots of money and gives lots of it to the Republicans. Don't think that he will not pressure the Republicans with it. Don't think that he will not turn on a dime and become a Democrat again, (that is what he is anyway, he only became a Republican to get elected.) He can not get re-elected again and has said that he does not want to seek any other office so he has nothing to loose.


7 Orange County Police Departments sign on to NYAGV's Assault weapons and ammo ban. 6 Orange County Police Departments sign on to
NYAGV's Assault weapons and ammo ban.
See story below.

     The Following police departments have their name listed as part of the New Yorkers Against Gun Violence's list of 120 Police Departments that support the new Assault Weapons Ban. Please contact them and let them know how you feel.


Town of Blooming Grove Police Department
Chief Carl Schupp
2 Horton Rd.
Blooming Grove, NY 10914

Village of Chester Police Department
Acting Chief Peter Graziano
47 Main St.
Chester, NY 10918
(845) 469-4681

Middletown New York Police Department
Chief Matthew Byrne
2 James St.
Middletown, NY 10940
(845) 343-3151

Town of New Windsor Police Department
Chief Michael C. Biasotti
555 Union Ave
New Windsor, NY 12553
Phone: (845) 565-7000

Town of Tuxedo Police Department
Chief Daniel J. Carlin
PO Box 728
Tuxedo, NY 10987

Town of Woodbury Police Department
Chief Robert J. Kwiatkowski
386 Route 32
Central Valley, NY 10917
Phone: (845) 928-2341

     CLICK HERE to see the cover letter that I have written and CLICK HERE to see the report on the new AWB that I am sending each of them. Please e-mail me at if you talk to one of those listed and they tell you anything.

2005 Pistol License applications for Orange County 2004 Pistol License applications for Orange County

  1999  2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 CHANGE % increase
New Applications 326 374 508 600 431 422 446
Amendments 1624 1763 1920  1870 1920 1,772 2,150

     Pistol License applications were up slightly in the last year following the surge in 2001 and 2002 caused by retiring NY City Police officers. Amendments were up because Orange County has switched to the new credit card size plastic license. Many people prefer the plastic card to the paper license so they are requesting a DUPLICATE license by filing a PISTOL LICENSE AMENDMENT.


     The Annual Hudson Highland Friends of the NRA Dinner will be held on Friday night, March 4th at Kuhl’s Highland House in Middletown. Upstate NY NRA Field Representative Jay Rusnock is coordinating the event as usual with help from the local Committee. This is really a grand event with several hundred people attending and hundreds of prizes and raffles to win. (I have won a handgun, a rifle, a combo shotgun and many other prizes at these event.) The NRA is providing 6 Special NRA guns to be given away and we will have the famous "WALL OF GUNS" where we sell 50 tickets and draw for a gun and if you win you get to pick the gun or other prizes you want out of the may to select from.
     You never know what will show up as a Bucket Raffle Prize and they will have plenty of those and if your luck is not as good as we would like, you can always win one of the Silent Auction items or bid on one of the regular Auction items.
     This is always a good way to meet other gun owners and other outdoor sports people from Orange County and the surrounding area.

Friends of the NRA 2006 Prizes


Wall of Guns

Rogero Shotgun

44 mag

2004 DINNER, 2003 DINNER , OR 2002 DINNER

John BrowingMater Class to hold their 8th Annual John Browning Combo Match Mater Class to hold their 8th Annual
John Browning Combo Match

     Mater Class Shooters Supply in Monroe is going to hold their 8th Annual John Browning Combo Match on January 8th. All you need to enter is to have any gun made by John Moses Browning who is America's greatest gun inventor. Among some of the types of guns he invented Lever Action Repeating Rifles, Automatic shotguns, Machine guns, and Handguns including Colt's .45 ACP M1911 Government Model and FN's Browning High-Power among others. This match combines BULLSEYE, STEEL PLATES, COMBAT COURSE AND MOVING TARGETS.
     This is one of the most fun shoots that you can attend and money prizes will be awarded. It is worth it just for the food.

2006 Match Results

Additional awards for the John Browning
Highest scoring shooter using a Browning design pistol in optic class is Rich B. for an additional $25.
Highest scoring shooter using a Browning design pistol in iron class is Mike C. for an additional $25.
Lowest scoring shooter in Bullseye is Mark Diana who gets a box of ammo.
Lowest scoring shooter in combat is John D. who gets a box of ammo
Lowest scoring shooter in plates is Lloyd J. who gets a box of ammo.
Lowest scoring shooter in the mover is Larry W. who gets a box of ammo.
     Ever since the John Browning match was designed (by Josh Siegel " and Dennis Serpi) back in 1997, we've had nothing but a great time. We've seen some really spectacular performances and we've seen some real classic's 0 and Mark's 15-0x. Anyway you look at it, it's the most fun one can have in 2 hours.
Every year we take reservations for this match over the phone and the competitors make their relays even if they're sliding in . At the bell (Todd.) This year they had a situation they just cannot understand...They had 5 shooters make reservations and not show, not call, not pay, and I guess generally not care about others were turned away because we honored their reservation. This situation caused the loss of $225 in shooters award money. Master Class will hereafter not honor reservations from those who failed to show, call or care about the other shooters. Shooters who are a bit dissatisfied with the payout can take it up with these guys. In the future, we will accept reservation only with total pre- payment. Period.
     Everyone did get full on all of the food that was available and everyone looks forward to the 2007 John Browning Combo Match


Orange County Trappers Annual Dinner Orange County Trappers Annual Dinner

     The Orange County Trappers  will hold their Annual Dinner on Jan-14 at Kuhl’s Highland House in Middletown. The event will have many raffles and bucket prizes. Several awards will be given out recognizing those individuals and groups who have contributed to help preserve our outdoor activates. Tickets are only $30 and the food will be great. gets 230,000 hits in 2005 gets 230,000 hits in 2005 had a record setting year as far as the number of visits. A little over 230,000 hits were recorded across the whole site with ,YOUTH MODEL FIREARMSBUYING YOUR FIRST GUN AND LEARNING HOW TO SHOOT, KIDS AND GUNS, STORES AND RANGES AND GUNSHOWS being the most popular pages. All of the pages having to do with getting a handgun license and Hunting had a lot of hits as did two gun stores, Master Class and Bob's Gun Exchange. The most popular Photo Album page, as always was the SAFE ROOM.
     The year ended with the last three months all over 23,000 each with November setting the record at 27,552 and the hits come from all over the world. Seychelles, Estonia, Cocos (Keeling) Islands, Brunei Darussalam , Burkina Faso, Liechtenstein, Tonga, and Nepal are just a few of the places where people have visited this web site from.
     Some of the URLs have logged on are,, Federal Bureau of Prisons, Otaway newspapers, U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service,,, CBS Studio Center, Office of NYS Attorney General Eliot Spitzer,,,,, and the
One of the most popular pictures is one from June/July and is a picture of Sen. H****** R***** C****** kissing Suha Arafat.

4th Annual Sportsmans Banquet at Calvary Baptist Church 4th Annual Sportsman’s Banquet at Calvary Baptist Church
Jan 7th 2006 at 6pm
5 Wisner Rd.
Warwick NY 10990


     Each year the Calvary Baptist Church has a better and better event and this year it was the same. The food was just great and we had more than enough for everyone, some of us even had seconds. (That I might not have had if I had know in advance what wonderful deserts they were going to have.) A big thanks goes to those who cooked and worked to set everything out and supplied the food and to Eric C. Dammann, Associate Pastor, who planed everything and is a wonderful host.
    Robert A. Gatto of  Gatto's Taxidermy Studio from Middletown, (343-1079,) supplied some great mount to see. I got a big kick out of the Turkey being attacked. He also had Deer mounts a great Pheasant mount, bear, fish and other mounts.
     Charles Alsheimer gave a great presentation and many of the people who attended took the opportunity to purchase one of his great books, posters or pictures. Visit his web site to get an idea of what you missed, He had a wonderful slide show with great pictures that he has taken around the world. He gave a great explanation of the fall Deer rut and how to time it and what the sun, moon and other factors have to do with it. As a new Deer hunter it really explained what was going on. Charles was accompanied by his wife, Carla, (his son is at school,) and gave a real heart felt message that everyone really appreciated.
     If you missed this one make sure that you try to go to the next on in January of next year. It is a cheep night out, you get to hang out with other hunters, you get a great presentation that if you had to buy tickets to it at any other place would cost your $50 just for the food and another $35 to $50 for the presentation. It is worth the money just to see the mount.

     This year's banquet will have the great food that it is noted for and Charles Asheimer will give a great presentation on white-tail deer. They only have room for 125 people so make your reservations early. It is a great way to start the year. Call Call 986-2137 or e-mail me at for more information.
     Charles Alsheimer is a noted hunter, author and wildlife photographer. As a field editor for Deer and Deer Hunting magazine and a regular contributor to several other leading outdoor publications, Charlie Alsheimer is committed to providing the latest insights on whitetail behavior and deer hunting strategies. In recent years, Alsheimer's writing has helped fuel the emergence of quality deer management and has shaped the debate over the moon's impact on deer behavior. Charlie Alsheimer conducts several dozen speaking engagements throughout the United States each year.
     Charlie Alsheimer's Ultimate Deer Hunting Seminar is a high-energy, information-packed session that covers all of the latest deer research and hunting tactics. Each seminar includes a multi-media presentation that focuses on the whitetail and features Charlie's photography. When speaking to a church audience, Charlie combines a spectacular multi-media presentation with an inspirational message.
     I have been to 2 of the 3 dinners and they have all been great. I expect to attend this one and will have pictures in Jan. newsletter. HERE ARE SOME PICTURES FROM THE 2004 EVENT


Join us on March 14th for the Annual March on Albany

     Each year the sportsmen and women from Orange County travelto Albany to participate in the NEW YORK STATE CONSERVATION COUNCIL's annual March on Albany. This year the March will be on March 14th. but the Federation will not have a bus as in previous years. Make sure that you plan to go.
     If you want to take the trip and meet with the peoplewho are going to vote who vote on the bills that will impact you in many areas of your life including your right to hunt, fish, own guns and all of the taxes, fees that you pay and the laws, rules and regulations that you have to follow. CLICK HERE TO SEE A REPORT ON LAST YEARS TRIP

NYAGV dupes police departments to sign onto AWB NYAGV dupes police departments to sign onto AWB & Ammo Ban

     NEW YORKERS AGAINST GUN VIOLENCE has done it again. Last Year, NYAGV came out with a list of 60 police departments that they say signed a petition in support of the new, improved AWB. The NY bill, A2466A , is copied it from the "Model Law Banning Assault Weapons" by The Coalition To Stop Gun Violence based, ( ) in Washington, DC and the "Model Law Banning Assault Weapons" from the Legal Community Against Violence, ( )based in San Francisco, CA., both IANSA groups.
     What NYAGV does is to send out a petition with vague wording that does not give out any specific information about the bill. It is like if I sent out a petition that said: Please sign this petition to support bill "A 1234, A BILL TO END SHOOTOUTS WITH POLICE." Who would not sign that but really the bill would say that the police were not able to carry guns anymore. I guess that would end the shoot outs because the police could not shoot back.
     Last year I called 5 or 6 of the people who had signed the petition. All of them ended up hanging up on me even though I was nice and did not misrepresent who I was or what I was doing. They got mad when I asked them what they knew about the bills and that the new laws would ban many popular guns in use today and would not punish criminals.
     The petition covers the following bills and 120 people have signed it:
A2466 & S5504; Assault weapons ban that really bans hunting guns and competition guns.
A2837: Hunting ammunition and personal defense ammo ban.

New York Police Combat Association has new Blog New York Police Combat Association has new Blog,
Announces 2006 Match Schedule

      The NYPCA has launched a new Blog that will have all of the information that you need to shoot in the matches and other information. The Blog looks great and is one of the best that I have seen. Make sure you check it out at:
     You can see the 2006 Schedule and find the link on by CLICKING HERE

Anti-gun Bills in the Assembly Anti-gun Bills in the Assembly

Too late, all of the bills passed the
Assembly on 1/9/06

CLICK HERE: to see Jacob J. Rieper's BLOG Gun Legislation & Politics in New York BLOG of the Assembly session.

     All of the bills went through the Assembly in ONE DAY! Just shows you what we can expect if the anti-gun forces take over the NY Senate and we have an anti-gun Governor. Nothing that we can say makes it through the thick heads of the anti-gun forces. They have no data to support their proposals and do not know enough about guns to even understand that the laws that they pass will not impact the criminals very much if at all but will ban the very types of guns that they say they support; guns used in hunting and target shooting. They don't care if they put all of the gun stores out of business or if they ban hunting ammo.


Click here to view a list of the police and sheriff's departments around the state that have signed a resolution in support of the 50-caliber ban and the armor-piercing ammunition ban, A2466 & S5504- AW BAN, and A2837 AMMO BAN. (Note that while the discription said (support of 50-caliber ban) but the list does not include the bill number.)

     The New York State Conservation Council Legislative sent out an Alert on 1-7-2005 that list the following bill. Everyone is going to oppose each one. They are all a bunch of crap that will only punish gun owners and shut down all gun stores in NY. Just what insurance company is going to give any gun store $1,000,000 + required when the law holds a gun store responsible when a 3rd party using a stolen gun uses the gun in a crime. My Comments in BLUE
    The AWB part is from the "Model Law Banning Assault Weapons" by The Coalition To Stop Gun Violence based, ( ) in Washington, DC and the "Model Law Banning Assault Weapons" from the Legal Community Against Violence, ( )based in San Francisco, CA. These groups have produced model laws to ban what they are call assault weapons. Lavelle's bill is an almost word for word copy of the almost identical laws proposed by these two anti-gun groups including outdated references, "According to FBI data, between 1998 and 2001," from the CSGV model law.
     Both groups are members of IANSA, The International Action Network on Small Arms. The UN working group that is trying to end private gun ownership of any type in the entire world and these bills are a good start.
     Sheldon Silver is still mad about loosing this debated when Gov. Mario Pataki got the gun bills passed in the special session at the end of 2005. Those bills did not punish legal gun owners enough, did not ban any guns or close down gun stores so he is not happy.
     All of these bills are the same or almost the same as the bills that passed last year.

NY's Assault Weapons Ban, A2466, Right from Washington, DC and San Francisco, CA. NY's Assault Weapons Ban, A2466, Right from the UN via Washington, DC and San Francisco, CA.
A2466, bill to expand Assault Weapon to include almost all semi-autos and pump guns NY Assemblyman John W. Lavelle wants your guns, Sponsors A2466, bill to expand Assault Weapon to include almost all semi-autos and pump guns and end "grandfather clause"
New Yorkers Against Gun Violence promotes AW Ban New Yorkers Against Gun Violence promotes AW Ban This article also outline how NYAGV sends out a petition that does not contain specific information about the law to get people to sign on to the ban.

NYSCC Alert:
The following bills are on the Assembly Rules Committee Agenda for Monday January 9, 2006 at 1:45 PM. We are asking you and all other gun owners to make contact with your Assembly person to express your opposition. In addition please contact the members of the rules and codes committees. Contact your legislator today at any number you may have, be sure to contact them via fax or email, whatever way BUT PLEASE MAKE CONTACT BEFORE MONDAY NOON.

  • A 673A WEISENBERG, PAULIN, RAMOS, EDDINGTON, LIFTON, JOHN, CLARK, NOLAN, CARROZZA, LOPEZ, GRANNIS, TITUS-- An act to amend the penal law, the general business law and the education law, in relation to criminally negligent storage of a weapon and weapons safety programs for children LOCK UP ALL OF YOUR GUNS AND AMMO ALL OF THE TIME.
  • 1170 DINOWITZ, PHEFFER-- An act to amend the penal law and the correction law, in relation to eliminating the relief granted by a certificate of good conduct or certificate of relief from disabilities for a person convicted of a violent felony offense to lawfully possess a gun THEY WANT THE TO VOTE WHEN THEY ARE STILL IN PRISON BUT NEVER BE ABLE TO GET A GUN NO MATTER WHAT THEIR CRIME WAS, WHEN IT WAS OR WHAT THEY HAVE DONE.
  • 2213 KOON, LAVELLE, PAULIN, MAYERSOHN, ZEBROWSKI-- An act to amend the executive law, in relation to the compilation of firearm and ballistic data to require that all shell casings, bullet and gun be submitted to the state police. THEY HAVE THE GUN, THEY HAVE THE CRIMINAL BUT THEY STILL HAVE TO SUBMITT EVERYTHING EVERY TIME?
  • A2466A LAVELLE, KOON, LAFAYETTE, COOK-- An act to amend the penal law and the general business law, in relation to banning the possession, sale or manufacture of assault weapons and to repeal subdivision 22 of section 265.00 of the penal law relating thereto THE NEW AWB BECAUSE THE FIRST ONE "DOES NOT GO FAR ENOGH" THE GUN MAKERS BUILD THE GUNS THE WAY THE AWB TOLD THEM TO BUILD THEM AND IT IS STILL NOT GOOD ENOUGH. THIS WILL BAN MANY HUNTING GUNS AND TARGET GUNS. NO GRANDFATHER CLAUSE. ANYTHING WITH A COMP BANNED? Note that PL400 "2. Types of licenses. ... A license for a pistol or revolver, other than an assault weapon or a disguised gun," so if you have a handgun that is an AW you can not have it on your license.
  • A2837 KOON, TOKASZ, JOHN, DESTITO, RAMOS, DINOWITZ, HOOPER, EDDINGTON, ZEBROWSKI--An act to amend the penal law, in relation to the possession of armor piercing, frangible or devastator ammunition A BAN ON MOST HUNTING / TARGET AMMO
  • 4471A EDDINGTON, BING, LIFTON, BRADLEY, RAMOS, LAVELLE-- An act to amend the penal law and the executive law, in relation to banning the sale, possession or use of 50-caliber weapons NO ONE HAS EVER USED ONE IN ANY CRIME ANYWHERE EVER.
  • 9280 PAULIN, SILVER, LENTOL-- An act to amend the general business law and the penal law, in relation to preventing the sale of firearms, rifles, and shotguns to criminals $1,000,000 PLUS INSURANCE, LOCK UP ALL GUNS IN A FIREPROOF GUN SAFE, NO AMMO THAT THE CUSTOMER CAN GET TO, NO GUNS ON OPEN DISPLAY, REPORT ALL ATF TRACES, LOTS OF PAPERWORK.

NYSCC Interviews with Eliot Spitzer NYSCC Interview with Eliot Spitzer

     Wally John from the New York State Conservation Council, did an interview with Spitzer and I can not believe that he did not do any follow up questions to Spitzer. The lawsuit against gun owners, over ruling the local DA and appealing the recent Federal lawsuit that NYSPA won that said the wording in the law that defined what a "Gun Show" was, was too broad. Spitzer, Silver, Hillary and Bloomberg; protecting your 2nd Amendment rights in Albany!! I feel so much better.

Questions that I would have asked:

  • What was the date the 2nd Amendment start being about hunting and not about being able to fight for our protection including against out own government?
  • When you said;  ''We have the capacity to squeeze manufacturers like a pincers and hurt them in the marketplace., We are bigger than the NRA (National Rifle Association).'' Were you trying to support the 2nd Amendment?
  • Were you trying to support the 2nd Amendment when you brought the lawsuit, (that you lost): ELIOT SPITZER, ATTORNEY GENERAL OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK, -againts- STURM, RUGER & COMPANY, INC., et al., Plaintiffs... asserting claims for statutory and common law public nuisance (Spitzer Press Release)
  • Were you supporting the 2nd Amendment when you tried to blackmail the gun makers by issuing an Executive Order, stating that the Department of Law will no longer purchase guns from any manufacturer that refuses to adopt the code of conduct and forming a coalition of anti-gun other Elected officials from across New York to follow the same guidelines? March 16, 2000 PR
  • Were you supporting gun owners when you appeared in the 2005 ad in support of Westchester's first accomplishment listed is Spano's fight with the NRA and Spitzer states that "The NRA fought him viciously but Andy Spano signed a bill that said that trigger locks were necessary,"


Q I need to ask you about gun control, which is a huge issue for sportsmen.
A Yes, and I want to be very clear on where I stand. My background is law enforcement. I'm a prosecutor by training and experience. My view is that you work to keep guns out of the hands of criminals, but have an abiding respect for the 2nd Amendment.
Q Can you be more specific? Do you think we need more gun control?
A I have absolutely no interest in doing anything that would have a negative impact on sportsmen. But I do think we need to do more to crack down on the illegal gun trade. I think we should drive unregistered dealers out of business. And I think we need to do all we can to keep guns out of the hands of criminals.
Q Some people think that you're "anti-gun." What do you say to them?
A It's just not true. The main thing we've tried to do is keep guns out of the hands of criminals. There is a tremendous problem with drug violence and gang violence in the cities and, working with law enforcement, we've tried to address it, but we've also tried to be mindful of the rights of sportsmen.
Q How are you going to convince people?
A Look, I don't expect to be endorsed by the NRA. There's probably nothing I can do to change that. But that's ok. The only thing that bothers me is the distortion of my positions. I believe that law abiding citizens should be able to own firearms. I believe that people have right to own and use their firearms in lawful ways -for hunting, shooting sports or as collectors. I believe our focus should be on the bad guys.
     I part company with the NRA on certain issues, but to me it's a question of balance. I am a firm believer in the First Amendment, but you shouldn't be able to yell "Fire" in a movie theater. I am a strong defender of the presumption of innocence, but I also think it is appropriate to screen passengers before they get on airlines. The same is true with respect to guns. How do we balance the rights of individuals to own guns against the rights of individuals to be safe from the misuse of guns? I support prohibitions against guns in schools because they help protect our children. I support firearm - safety courses for the same reason that I support student driver courses - they help prevent deadly accidents. I support gun fingerprinting for the same reason I support DNA testing - if a gun is used to kill someone, it is essential for law enforcement to know whose gun it was. I think background checks, in this day and age, are necessary and appropriate. I know it's a hassle to people, but it's something they have to put up with.
     I differ from the NRA on many of these issues, but, again, it's because I balance the issues differently than they do.
    The interesting thing is that, when I talk to gun owners in New York, they agree with me on most of these issues. Not all, but most. They agree with background checks to keep guns away from criminals. They recognize that in this age of terrorism and violence, some reasonable restrictions are appropriate.

Q The hunting population is aging out and we need to bring new people into the pastime. Do you support legislation to authorize a junior big game license?
A I don't have any problem with it. It works in other states. A young person who has been trained in the classroom and properly instructed by a family member in the field, that's someone who has been taught respect for firearms, taught to be a conservationist and that's a good thing.
Q Where are you on sportsman's fees?
A Fees should be dedicated to the Conservationist Fund. There should be no changes in the fee structure without a specific reason and without consultation with sportsmen's groups.

NY CoBIS or NY CoBIS or "GUN DNA" end of year update and possible "HIT"

     NY ended 2005 with 117,066 guns in the Database, with 28,404 guns being added in the year and that is a decrease of 463 handguns from 2004.
     December also was when Rochester got another "HIT" using NIBIN information. This is the second hit for Rochester and for the program. The first hit was an embarrassment for the program and we are still waiting to see if this "HIT" really does anything to solve a crime. Even the most skeptic of us would have thought that this program would have had one meaningful hit by now. I almost hope that this "HIT" solves some major crime, NY has waited almost 4 years for it and has spent $15 million or more for it. When I know more, you'll know more.

Where in the world is Andy Pelosi? Where in the world is Andy Pelosi?
To the tune of Where in the world is Carmen Sandiego?

As Executive Director for New Yorkers Against Gun Violence
He would travel across the state trying to get you disarmed
He would talk to the politicians, press and who ever else would listen
And then last November he was suddenly just gone.

Where in the world is Andy Pelosi?

They took his name off the Press Release and replaced it with Jackie Kuhls
And they gave her his title and the cell phone.
Now Andy's name's popped up at The After-School Corporation
Where now he's now the Coordinator of Government Relations

Where in the world is Andy Pelosi?

He's gone on to work for a group started by rich George Soros
Who gave 125 million from his Open Society
They're coming to your Boys and Girls Clubs with lots of new programs
and the local YMCA is another place they'll be.

Where in the world is Andy Pelosi?

Now I hope he does a good job and is very successful
and stops trying to take gun rights away from you and from me.
But some how I doubt it but at least you'll know who did it
when they ban all gun owners from the YMCA.

Now we know where in the world is Andy Pelosi.

     Andy Pelosi used to be listed as Executive Director for New Yorkers Against Gun Violence. He went missing a few months ago, at the same time Jackie Kuhls got the title and the cell phone. Andy Pelosi has moved on to The After-School Corporation in the position of Government Relations Coordinator. This group is another non-profit that was started by none other than George Soros's Open Society Institute and has programs in Boys and Girls Clubs and YMCAs among other places. Andy told me when I talked that after 8 years he had just moved on to a new job but he would still be working with NYAGV but just not getting paid.

Mission and History
     TASC began in 1998 with 25 programs in New York City and has grown to support more than 300 programs across New York serving over 55,000 children. TASC programs are operated by 130 community-based organizations such as Boys and Girls Clubs, neighborhood settlement houses and the YMCA.
      TASC began with a challenge grant from the Open Society Institute (OSI), which pledged $125 million, based on the condition that for every dollar OSI contributed, TASC was responsible for raising an additional three dollars. To date, TASC has leveraged more than $375 million in public and private funds. TASC's goal of sustaining after-school programs long after the OSI grant expires is now within reach, as the field of after-school has grown and flourished over the past decade.

NY City Justice, Rapist on parole who is arrested with 2 guns released on his own recognizance NY City Justice, Rapist on parole who is arrested with 2 guns
released on his own recognizance

HIGHLIGHT: Last week 21 year old Phillips, who was on parole after pleaded guilty to raping a 15-year-old girl in March of 2003, was arrested outside the Shanti Day Care where he lives for having two guns in his possession.  On Wednesday a Brooklyn Supreme Court judge released Phillips on his own recognizance
     (I wonder if the guns were registered?)

Exclusive: Community Upset Over Resident Rapist
Man Who Pleaded Guilty To Crime In 2003 Now Living In Daycare Center

Jan 4, 2006 10:56 pm US/Eastern, CBS New York News

      (CBS) NEW YORK Edna Rosa was shaking when she was told Cornelius Phillips, a man convicted of rape, was living below her in an East New York apartment at 703 Pine St.
      "It's scary because I have 4 children," Rosa said.
      The apartment also happens to be a daycare center run by the rapist's mother.
      The mother's friend and neighbor, Willie Johnson, said he didn't know Phillips was living next door.
      "I thought her sons were living upstate," Johnson said. "So I don't know who was living in that house."
      In March of 2003, 21-year-old Phillips pleaded guilty to raping a 15- year-old girl. He was placed on probation for being a youthful offender.
      Last week Phillips was arrested outside the Shanti Day Care where he lives for having two guns in his possession.
   But Wednesday a Brooklyn Supreme Court judge released Phillips on his own recognizance over the objections of the New York City Probation officials who on Wednesday night said in a statement:
      "We intend to come down hard on probationers arrested on weapons charges."
      Rosa says she can't believe the justice system would allow Phillips to go free.
      "It's messed up," she said.

Bill Hammond, Bill Hammond, "short of the mark."    

     Bill Hammond is a columnist for the New York Daily News and he wrote an opinion about Pataki's CoBIS or "Gun DNA" program. He has been contacted and has talked to several people who disagree with his position on CoBIS. He was also willing to talk to me about 45 min. to an hour about the article and was willing to listen and said that he was continuing to look at the subject. As one person who is familiar with CoBIS told me, that while Hammond did research the article and the article did contain some correct information, Hammond still does not understand how CoBIS works and, "He still fell short of the mark."
     Below is the article and my comments in BLUE. Sorry that it is so long.

Gov has promises to keep
Pataki must get tough on Washington to make bullet DNA program work
by Bill Hammond
Originally published on December 27, 2005

     ALBANY - So Gov. Pataki and the Legislature are promising yet another crackdown on gun violence. Good for them. Let's hope they follow through with the new laws to stiffen penalties for gun trafficking and crimes against cops better than they did the last time.
     I'm referring to Pataki's big gun control bill of 2000, which cemented his reputation as a centrist Republican who cares more about fighting crime than pleasing the NRA. The resulting law held a lot of promise. But it turned out to be a political promise, easily made and soon forgotten.
     Pataki's Gun Control bills and his campaign speech at a NY Million Mom March event only cemented his reputation as a RINO, Republican In Name Only. After winning his first election by asking and receiving support from NY gun owners, Pataki kept the 2000 bill secret until he proposed it and never talked to any of his pro-gun supporters when the bill was written and the bill was passed in a special 3 day section and only after much arm twisting in the NY Senate. It is interesting to note that no one stood up to talk against the bill when it passed but several anti-gun Senators did talk, not in support of the bill but saying that "this is a good first step but we need to do more." The new Gun Control laws were passed because Pataki and several Senators thought that they need it to pass to get reelected. Even some sections of the bill that would have been supported by most NY gun owners, were written by the anti-gunners and contained language that made the bills unsupportable like the section of the law that required background check of all sales at gun shows as a recent Federal Court found. "A federal judge Friday tossed out a significant portion of New York state law regulating firearms sales at gun shows. U.S. District Judge Charles Siragusa determined that one of the statute's definition of a gun show is so broad that it "infringes on ... constitutionally protected rights to free speech, assembly and petition." (Don't worry anti-gunners. AG Spitzer has overruled the local AG's office and has chosen to appeal the ruling.)
     It will be easy for any new law that impacts the criminals to do better than the laws that were passed in 2000 because almost all of the laws passed in 2000 only impacted the lawabiding gun owner, not the criminal.
     The revolutionary feature of the 2000 law was a plan to collect ballistic "fingerprints" from every new handgun sold in New York State. Pataki predicted that this "gun DNA" would solve crimes just as effectively as the genetic kind does.
     Only the anti-gunners who came up with the incorrect "Gun DNA" phrase said that the program would work. Even anti-gun California had already done 2 studies that showed that the program would not work and was never adopted. Real DNA does not change over time with use and you can not take a file or some sandpaper and change your own DNA. No study was done and no hearings were held about this bill because everyone knew what the results would be. Maryland had a program in place at that time that had not produced results. Pataki did not even know how much money was needed for the program and the anti-gunners made sure that the bill set no guidelines as to how to judge the program if the program was a success or failure. No one ever projected how many guns would be connected to a crime over time and they still don't today. When the bill passed they talked about "3 years time to crime," now that the program has failed they are talking about "7 to 10 years time to crime." We would not be talking about CoBIS now if the first bill had contained "sunset" language and some measure of success like a .5% hit rate.
      Five years and several million dollars later, however, Pataki's pet project has resulted in just one useful lead and exactly zero prosecutions.
     I guess "several million dollars" does not sound as bad as 14.7 million dollars, (numbers that DCJS claim,) to 20 million dollars, (that is in the budget.) and it produced one solid hit but that hit is not an example of the success of the program but is an example of its failure. The "HIT", according to rumor, (when I talked to Rochester they don't know what I am talking about,) connected a shell casing from a "shots fired" call with no witness and no victim to a gun that was already in police custody that was owned by a licensed gun owner who had already lost his license and the statute of limitation had already run out. Otherwise it could have been a "success" assuming that the person would have admitted to shooting his gun and not just have admitted to driving through the area and throwing some empty shell casing that he had in his pocket out the window and confessing that he was guilty of littering.
     Forget about the money for a while. The NY State Police have about 15 people working on CoBIS. That means that they have spent over 124,800 man hours on the program in the 4 plus years they have been working. Can anyone say that if the time had been spent doing anything else they would have not solved more crimes? Even if they were a guard at the state capitol they would have found some stupid criminals trying to go through a check point with guns, drugs or something else illegal. I support the people who work for this program 110% but I just can't believe that when they joined the NY State Police that they thought that they would be working in a program that was as unsuccessful as CoBIS has been. Spend the money and time on Cold Case Murders, I am sure that one of the 15 people will be able to come up with a lead in one or two old murders in the next 4 years. Not solve a case, just a lead.
      The state police have photographed the unique markings on shells from 114,763 revolvers and pistols and put the images into a computer database. But their handiwork is mostly gathering dust. The database is so inconvenient to use that the NYPD and other law enforcement agencies rarely take the trouble.
     The database is not inconvenient to use any more than any other program that deals with some type of unique form of evidence. The database is used every time anyone wants to use it. Besides the CoBIS program, the NY State Police have the following labs: Biosciences - Breath Testing - Case Review - Drug Chemistry - Evidence Receiving - Firearms - Forensic ID and SAFIS - Forensic Imaging - Photography - Questioned Documents - Toxicology - Trace Evidence. Are they not being used even though they are inconvenient? Is it somehow not inconvenient to sent evidence to them on every crime except when the evidence is a shell casing? NYPD is a world unto themselves, they don't even belong to the Federal NIBIN program but they have their own IBIS system.
      No inquiries means no "hits." And no hits means no handcuffs.
      No, no "hits" means that the program is not working, like we said it would not work, and no "hits" means that the anti-gun proponents where wrong. Even those people who support the program agree that a CoBIS "Hit" probably can not be used in a trial. The most anyone ever expected a "Hit" to produce is a trail that they can follow to find usable evidence because of "chain of evidence" problems that CoBIS has. No NY Court has ever ruled that you can use a CoBIS "Hit" as probable cause for a search warrant.
      The situation gives ammunition to Second Amendment absolutists, who portray the program as a waste of time and money. But compiling gun DNA remains a good idea. It's up to the governor to make it work.
     What does this have to do with the Second Amendment? This is not gun control it is just a waste of money and manpower. The only reason the pro-gun groups talk about this program besides the waste is that it is another example of the gun-control groups passing a laws based on their "feeling" that it is a "good idea" and not based on science or reason. A program that has no guidelines, no goals, no success, an unlimited budget and no way to end it.
      The biggest problem is user-friendliness, or the lack of it. If cops could just Google a shell casing, they'd make it part of their routine - even if the chances of finding a match are slim. As it is, cops have to schlep the casings to the state police lab in Albany. No wonder the lab has processed only 467 direct inquiries from local police, a mere fraction of the thousands of gun investigations over the past four years.
     Hammond has been watching too much CSI: Crime Scene Investigation on TV. You can't "google" regular human DNA and you will never be able to be able to "google" CoBIS info but the State Police is working to make the program more user friendly to the 9 labs around the state that can process the information. Hammond chose to ignore the thousands of inquiries that the program has processed using NIBIN information that has supplied the two hits that the program has gotten. (Something he acknowledge when I talked to him.) That is like saying the only DWI arrest that you will consider when looking at how aggressive NY is in arresting people for DWI are those people who are arrest at DWI checkpoints but you choose not to including anyone who is arrested because the police see them driving drunk while patrolling for drunk drivers.
      "Nobody thought about the fact that law enforcement around the state is not likely to stick their evidence in an envelope and send it away to Albany," said Jackie Kuhls of New Yorkers Against Gun Violence. "Law enforcement is also unlikely to get in a car and drive five hours."
     Jackie Kuhls does not know how the system works and Hammond does not understand enough about the program to know that this is not true. We have 7 places where an FFL can take a gun to be test fired and we have machines in 9 different police departments around the state that can process evidence that can be submitted to CoBIS. People send evidence via mail, UPS and FedX every day to all the other labs that the state has. The most a police department would have to do is take the evidence to the local NY State Police headquarters. How hard is that?
     Kuhls group, NYAGV, has had time to "think about it" by now yet they wrote and are pushing bills in the Assembly today that would require all shell casings to be sent to the State Police just like they wrongly say is happening now. The bill would require that all police send in all shell cases, even if the police have the gun and have the criminal. That will produce more "HITS" and be a total waste of manpower and money, (something that Hammond agreed with when I talked to him.) NYAGV, because of the promised success of the current program, also wants to expand the CoBIS program to include all shotguns and rifles, something that would expand the program 5 to 10 fold or more. Because long guns are only used in a small fraction of crimes and they are not licensed by owner, make, model and serial number like handguns, this new database would be an even bigger waste of time and money, (something that Hammond agreed with when I talked to him.) I know that it is hard to believe but Kuhls has testified that NYAGV supports laws to establish a national ballistics database. How many billions of dollars would that cost? (I can see the antis press release now, "This national system would work if we only give it 10 more years and get Canada, Mexico and all of the other countries in South America to adopt the system.")
      Despite the obstacles, the database recently scored its first useful match, which is still under investigation.
     How can Hammond count this match that was found using NIBIN information when he left out the thousands of inquiries that have been done using the NIBIN info? Notice that he said "useful match" because he knows that it is not the first "match" that CoBIS has had. By choosing to ignore the first match that CoBIS had, he does not have to explain away a "match" that is useful because it shows the failure of the program to produce results that the anti-gunners promised. As far as if this 2nd hit is a "useful match," we still don't know that. When they got the first match they thought that it would be "useful" then they found out that it was such a waste of time that Hammond does not talk about it or even acknowledge its existence.
      If the governor wants more hits, he needs a network of machines across the state capable of scanning shell casings and checking them against the database. A network like that already exists, set up by the FBI and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms to service their own database, which is limited to weapons used in previous crimes. But, thanks to the NRA, Congress prohibits linking these federal machines to any database of legal guns, including New York's.
     Again, we already have a "network of machines across the state capable of scanning shell casings." Earth to Hammond: It is just not the NRA's only 4 million members. It is the simple fact that most people in most states do not want any registry of guns and gun owners like we accept in NY. NY is the only state that registers not only the owner but each handgun by make, model and serial number. That specifically is illegal in many states according to state law. Most people who do not even belong to the NRA know that if the government knows who owns guns and what guns they own, at some point the government might want to pass a law and then come pick up the guns. Never happen you say. It has already happened in NY City, NJ and CA and they are getting ready to start picking up guns in San Francisco and Columbus Ohio. Remember New Orleans?.
      To keep his promise of 2000, Pataki must either persuade Washington to repeal this ridiculous rule, find a clever way around it or bite the bullet and pay for a separate state network.
     Again Hammond does not really know how this system works. NY has found a way around this law, and while it is a clever way that I think is not a technical violation of the law, it is a clear violation of the intent of the law. This "clever way" is what has produced the only two "hits" that the system has had. What does Hammond mean when he talks about a "separate state network?" The NY State Police already has their system of 5 machines and 9 other cities or counties have the machines to process the shell casings. This is where all of the NIBIN data is coming from. Westchester had 28 NIBIN type "HITS" back in 2003 using their IBIS equipment and an IBIS Data Acquisition Station (DAS) Remote Workstation cost over $250,000. Is Hammond saying that NY should spent another two to three million dollars to double the machines that we have and spend additional money to train the technician that are needed to use them and some how because we are using these new machines we will get "hits" that we can not get using the machines that are already in place and being used? Where are we going to put the machines, Westchester County, NY City, Rochester? They already have IBIS equipment so they don't need new equipment along with the other 6 or more locations that have the equipment. How many machines do you really need? CoBIS has 4 machines that process up to 30,000 shell cases a year so that is 7,500 shell cases per machine per year so in NY we already can process 67,500 shell cases a year using the equipment that we already have without using the NY State Police equipment. So NY can process more than 67,500 shell casings a year and Hammond thinks that we need more +$250,000 machines?
      Then maybe New York could match the success of Maryland's ballistic-imaging program, which scored its first conviction - for murder, no less - this year.
   Success, Success??? Where is the proof that the conviction depended on the MD-IBIS system? (UPDATE: Maryland’s Automated Ballistic Fingerprinting IBIS System Played No Role in Convicting a Murderer) Hammond fails to say that the Maryland State Police have produced a report that calls for the ending of the program,  "It is recommended that this Program be suspended, a repeal of the collection of cartridge cases from current law be enacted and the Laboratory Technicians associated with the Program be transferred to the DNA Database Unit.". Hammond told me that he left that little bit of information out because the NYAGV's Kuhls told him that the newly elected Maryland Governor was against the program. Could it just be that the Governor was against the program because the program is a failure? What about the 2+ years the previous "anti-gun" Governor who wrote the bill, pushed the bill and signed it into law using the law written by the anti-gunners? He had no more "success" than the current Governor has had. One of the reasons that the new Governor was elected was because he promised to look at the program and end it if it was not a success. Note that Kuhls does not say that the program is a success, just that the report was written under a Governor who can see that the program is a failure and wants to end it. Have we gotten to the point that only an anti-gun Governor can end a program that is a total failure and has wasted millions of dollars and hundreds of thousands of man hours only if the Governor supports the program. But, if any Governor ever decides that he can not support the program any more because it is a failure and a waste of time and money then the Governor can not end the program because he is against it?
      The Pataki administration "passed the bill and took credit for creating this, but then they didn't use it," Kuhls said. "To have it and not use it doesn't make any sense. Let's give it a real chance."
     The Pataki administration was sold a bad program by NYAGV and passed the law that NYAGV wrote and supported and has funded the program with as much money as it needs every year and put hard working people in charge of the program that support the program and work hard at making sure that it is used 100% of the time. The problem is that after all of the tens of millions of dollars have been spent and the hundreds of thousands of man hours have been wasted, NYAGV has to find some excuse as to why this program does not work and someone else to blame it on while at the same time they write more laws expanding the program and promote new laws using the same, according to them, failed system that CoBIS has now. Talk about having it both ways! A failure after 4 years, NYAGV needs to find a reason to keep this program going another 3 to 5 years, (or as many years as they can keep the program going,) because they hope that in that time they get what they really want and it will only take one or two hits for them to have what they are after.
     NYAGV's goal for this program really is that they hoped that it would show licensed NY handgun owners using their licensed guns in untraceable crimes or giving, lending or renting licensed handgun to criminals that use the guns in crimes. It will only take one crime for them to demand a"crack down" on licensed gun owners and for further restrictions on legal gun owners like renewable licenses and requiring that the police inspect every gun you own every year. That is always the real goal of NYAGV, to make all gun ownership as restricted as possible if not illegal. How people in the Press like Hammond can give any credibility to anything that the claim or say after they have been proven so wrong so many times is beyond me. The Maryland State Police report is to be ignored because the current Maryland Governor is suppose to be "pro-gun" even though the program, that was written by Maryland anti-gun groups and Governor, has been a failure but NYAGV who wrote and supported the current NY CoBIS program, that has produced almost no results, and supports the 10+ times expansion of the current CoBIS program and a national program on top of that and is against all gun ownership is always 100% credible and to be believed. All NYAGV needs to prove a point is one case or just say that something is a "good idea" while anyone supporting any pro-gun legislation or against laws that waste money or do not work and only punish legal gun owners can never have enough proof.
     Who is NYAGV? They have almost no membership and get most off their money from grants from anti-gun foundations and individuals. Look on their web site. They have almost no information about the laws or the programs that they are pushing. Their leaders are paid lobbyist who do this as a job and work for who ever will give them the money just like the X-Executive Director who, according to NYAGV, "has moved on to another non-profit" that was started with $125 million by none other than George Soros's Open Society Institute. Talk about a "Special interest group" if ever their was one.

     I just wish that Hammon would write an article about how unfair NY City's gun laws are, that the licenses cost too much for the common citizen, are too restrictive and have too much red tape and that a NY City license should be good throughout the state. New York City citizens should not be second class citizens. Or how about a story about NYSAGV? You could cover how it is a "Foundation" group with few real members and would not be able to operate without foundation money. How the people who run it do not own guns and do not know much about guns or gun safety. That while many of the pro-gun groups do support some gun control laws and push to have them passed, NYAGV always pushes for more gun control though many of the current laws and regulations do not have an impact on crime and NYAGV has never supported any change that would reduce any gun law or regulation

Jackie Kuhls:
     "We would like to mention Resolution No. 584, which supports the BLAST Act, which is the Ballistics Law Assistance Safety Technology Act, which would establish a national ballistics database. New York is one of only two states with a ballistic imaging database, it's also in Maryland. In this database the manufacturers submit shell casings which are imaged and put into a database of new guns. Now, this database is most useful after a number of years because you have to allow time to expire since these are new guns, but ultimately the database is very useful for law enforcement, and in fact, we are supporting and measuring the State to expand the ballistic database to guns that do not readily eject shell casings, such as revolvers, as well as to long guns and to require images of the bullets and shell casings for top crime guns. We think this will maximize the help to law enforcement. And the BLAST Act that's pending in Congress would call for a national database, which will be particularly useful for New York City since the vast majority of guns come from out of state, so to have this new gun database running would be critical for law enforcement. "
 (Note that the current NY CoBIS system that started in 2001 does include all revolvers. I guess Jackie does not even know the law that her group helped write.)


     SCOPE is going to raffle off an Arctic CAT 400 ATV that was donated by the Gander Mtn. in Tonawanda, NY. You only have till Feb. 1st to buy your ticket so make sure CONTACT INFO@SCOPEny.ORG
or call

     Tickets are only $20 so take a chance and the money goes to help save your rights in NY.


NY City Mayor to push for more gun control in Albany and Washington DC. NY City Mayor to push for more gun control in Albany and Washington DC.NY City Mayor to push for more gun control in Albany and Washington DC.

     Mayor Bloomberg supports gun control in all forms. Under his leadership, NY City has stopped issuing the normal Pistol license and raised the fees for a license renewal to $340 for handguns and $140 for a long gun license and he has said that banning handguns is something that might be considered. He plans to do more in his last 4 years. The following is part of MAYOR BLOOMBERG's 2nd INAUGURAL ADDRESS.  Expect him to sign on to all of NYAGV's anti-gun proposals.

“     Our most urgent challenge is ending the threat of guns and the violence they do. Twice in recent weeks, police officers have been struck down by gunfire on our streets. Twice the flags flying on this plaza have been lowered to half-staff, and the sound of pipes and drums has escorted brave and decent young men on their final journeys.
      “Detectives Dillon Stewart and Daniel Enchautegui were among twelve of New York City’s Finest who gave their lives in the line of duty during the last four years.
    “Now we have a duty as well, one that rises above all partisan politics, and one we will pursue relentlessly: And that is to rid our streets of guns, and punish all those who possess and traffic in these instruments of death.
      “This is a national threat – one that crosses city lines and state boundaries.
      “To meet it, we must, and we will, make common cause with our fellow Americans.
      “We will take our message to Albany, to Washington, and to every capital of every state that permits guns to flow freely across its borders.
      “And to those who distort our laws to aid and abet hardened criminals, know this: We will not rest until we secure all of the tools we need to protect New Yorkers from the scourge of illegal guns.
      “Public safety is the foundation of our city’s prosperity.
      “Without it, our quality of life, our economy, our efforts to reform the schools would surely falter.

     Other past Bloomburg quotes, (who, besides his police escort, provides his own security and I would guess that they are armed,) :

  • Bloomberg quote, from NY Post article, 3/17/04, "Keep in mind, outlawing real guns is a problem in this country with the NRA. How any parent or caring human being looking at the carnage on the streets of this country and not want to outlaw guns I can't quite understand."
  • Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg, "I don't know why people carry guns. Guns kill people."
  • Asked by program host John Gambling whether handguns should be banned, Bloomberg mused, "I'm not so sure I wouldn't think that is a good idea."

Pledge to carry gun battle across nation


     Once content to rule the city, Mayor Bloomberg yesterday vowed for the first time to go national - with an all-out effort to crack down on illegal gun sales.
      With the shooting deaths of two NYPD cops still weighing on the city - and with his confidence as a political player clearly rising - Bloomberg promised in his second term to fight the fight over illegal handguns in every forum that matters.
      "We will take our message to Albany, to Washington and to every capital of every state that permits guns to flow freely across its borders," said Bloomberg.
      "And to those who distort our laws to aid and abet hardened criminals, know this," he said, punching the air for emphasis. "We will not rest until we secure all of the tools we need to protect New Yorkers from the scourge of illegal guns."
      Although Bloomberg has talked before about the need for stricter gun controls, yesterday was the first time he pledged to do battle in individual statehouses throughout the U.S.
      The new push underscored the growing sense of urgency in the city surrounding illegal firearms, which helped fuel a 3% increase in shooting victims last year.
      But it also reflected a mayor who, after four years of mostly learning the political ropes in New York, is confident enough to take his game to the national level, experts said.
      Gun control advocates said that as the Republican mayor of the country's largest city - and one of the GOP's most generous donors - Bloomberg could be uniquely positioned to influence the national gun control debate.
      "If he can make an alliance of governors and mayors - particularly Republican governors and mayors - it could greatly help us," said Sen. Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.), an author of the Brady Bill, which requires background checks for handgun purchases. "We haven't had a major Republican voice speaking out for gun control in a long time."
      No matter what, with a Texas Republican in the White House and the National Rifle Association still among the biggest givers in Congress, it will be an uphill fight, Schumer added.
      NRA officials could not be reached for comment yesterday, but Bloomberg is already in the group's sights.
      When the mayor talked last month about the need to tighten gun laws after the shooting death of NYPD Officer Dillon Stewart - by a gun stolen in Florida - NRA spokesman Andrew Arulanandam said it was "despicable" for Bloomberg to inject politics into the debate.
      Others said Bloomberg's plan to take the fight to states where most of New York's illegal guns originate - with Florida and Georgia being prime culprits - was right on.
      "He needs to go to Florida and say, 'You sell thousands of guns that end up on our streets every year, and one of them killed a police officer in New York. What are you going to do about that?'" said Jackie Kuhls, executive director of New Yorkers Against Gun Violence.

Mike's resolutions
      Mayor Bloomberg's second inaugural address yesterday included promises to:

  • Launch a national effort to crack down on illegal guns.
  • Speed up the rebuilding of lower Manhattan and create a "sustainable residential and commercial community" - a clear reference to his call for housing at Ground Zero.
  • "Lock in and extend" reforms granting mayoral control over city schools, which the state can revoke after 2008.
  • Continue to drive down crime and improve public safety, which he called "the foundation of our city's prosperity."
  • Be "fiscally responsible." City government "can and must live within its means," he said.

Mayor's Gun Talk Begets a Warning from Rifle Group

BY JULIA LEVY - Staff Reporter of the Sun
January 3, 2006

     Only hours after Mayor Bloomberg vowed in his second inaugural address to launch a national campaign against "illegal guns," the gun rights lobby is mobilizing to respond, with the influential National Rifle Association accusing the mayor of "intimidating law abiding Americans."
      On Sunday, as Mr. Bloomberg was sworn in for his second term, he invoked the names of police officers shot and killed in the line of duty as he announced a new, central focus of his administration - protecting New Yorkers from what he called "the scourge of illegal guns" by taking a message for tougher gun laws to "Albany, to Washington, and to every capital of every state that permits guns to flow freely across its border." He called it the city's "most urgent challenge."
      The administration has yet to provide concrete details of its new approach, though it seems to involve asking other states to adopt and enforce New York-style laws requiring the registration and licensing of all handguns. But the ambiguity of the city's new gun agenda hasn't stopped Second Amendment proponents from beginning to fight back.
      "I think Mayor Bloomberg ought to focus on New York City, given that that's his area of responsibility. He has challenges over there because he has misplaced priorities," the director of public affairs at the National Rifle Association, Andrew Arulanandam, said. "Rather than focusing on enacting more gun control laws that only affect law abiding citizens, he should make sure that criminals pay the harshest penalties for breaking the law."
      When asked if the rifle association is intimidated by Mr. Bloomberg's newly aggressive posture, Mr. Arulanandam said: "We take every threat towards the rights of law abiding Americans seriously, but we think the mayor would be better served if he would put his financial muscle and the muscle of his office toward cracking down on criminals, not on intimidating law abiding Americans."
      Jacob Rieper, the legislative director for the rifle association's New York State affiliate, the New York State Rifle and Pistol Association, said he expects Mr. Bloomberg will meet substantial national opposition.
      "He just doesn't have the clout to carry this to other states. Other states outside of New York are getting rid of their gun control laws. New York City is the only one still trying to keep hope alive that criminals are going to pay attention to their laws," he said.
      Mr. Rieper added that Mr. Bloomberg seems to be saying "the entire United States is wrong and we're right," and said that attitude would not endear him to lawmakers outside of New York.
      A retired journalism professor who sells antique and collectable firearms at his antique shop in Montgomery, N.Y., Glenn Doty, said the last thing he wants as the father of two police officers are illegal guns on the streets. But, he said, that doesn't mean the Bloomberg administration should pursue a legislative remedy to gun violence.
      "A crackdown on the sale of illegal firearms is just fine with me. The problem that always seems to happen as soon as the politicians decide to crack down on illegal guns is they pass laws that harm people who own the guns legally," he said.
      While Mr. Doty said it seems New York gun laws are already harsh enough, he said he would support an effort to go after straw purchasers - those who buy guns in states with more relaxed gun laws and resell them in New York. He also said he would support other states adopting New York's standard that requires people buying guns at gun shows to undergo the same criminal background checks required for sales at federally licensed gun stores.
      Still, he said, it seems that a lot of progress could be accomplished though stricter federal monitoring of gun sales and enforcing current regulations rather than enacting new laws.
      A professor of criminology and criminal justice at Florida State University, Gary Kleck, dismissed Mr. Bloomberg's new agenda and said, "Politically, it's dead in the water."
      "The trend in recent years is the exact opposite direction," he said. "Republicans basically like more punishment for criminals, so the only type of gun control they favor is heavier penalties for crimes with guns or even heavier penalties for carrying illegal guns."
      In recent years Congress has passed laws forbidding lawsuits against those who manufacture guns and making it harder to gain access to gun sales data. The Bloomberg administration says the data privacy law makes it harder for law enforcement officials to trace guns for crime prevention purposes.
      Mr. Kleck, who is a nationally renowned authority on the study of guns, said, "The underlying flaw in the reasoning is its supply-side orientation. It's trying to reduce gun violence by reducing the supply of guns."
      Mr. Kleck said a "demand-side strategy" characterized by going after criminals and making it risky to own a gun would be a more effective approach.
      Despite early signs that Mr. Bloomberg's newly announced goal will face resistance, his effort is being greeted with support from gun control advocates.
      "What the mayor's called for is exactly what we've been trying to highlight for a number of years," the executive director of New Yorkers Against Gun Violence, Jackie Kuhls, said. "I think that he is in a very good position to influence national lawmakers and certainly current national office holders. He's contributed personally to the campaigns of some of these people. Also, he's the mayor of one of the biggest cities and the city that's most affected by illegal guns from other states."
      Ms. Kuhls added that Mr. Bloomberg's speech Sunday should serve as a "wake-up call" to states that supply illegal guns to New York.
      City Council Member David Yassky, who helped enact the gun control law known as the Brady Bill when he was working as an aide to then Rep. Charles Schumer, said he is "excited" about the new Bloomberg agenda
    Mr. Yassky said toughening gun laws nationally would not be easy, but he said, "I think he's in a good position to get real results. Really what we need is for Congress to change course. They've been loosening restrictions on the gun industry. They need to tighten restrictions."
      He said as a "prominent Republican" the mayor might be able to "hold others in his party accountable for their wrong decisions on guns."
      Mr. Yassky said the mayor should articulate his goals publicly and also actively publicize Police Department gun-tracing data so that everyone can better understand the impact of gun violence.
      "Americans are good-hearted people," he said. "If they can be made to understand that their laws are creating a serious gun problem in New York City, I think they'll take that seriously."
      The chief trial lawyer representing New York City in a lawsuit against gun manufacturers, Michael S. Elkin of Thelen Reid & Priest, said, "It's really important for individual municipalities to play a significant role. The national agenda is really influenced by the National Rifle Association, and they have significant hold or control over both the executive branch and members of Congress."
      Mr. Elkin said he thinks legislative reform will be left largely to local and state governments.
      While he said the rifle association would provide a serious challenge to the mayor's initiative, he said, "There is ample room for other local municipalities and state governments to take proactive steps to reduce the illegal firearm sales."
      According to police statistics, there were 3,303 gun-related arrests last year, up from 2,894 in 2004. Shooting incidents also rose to 1,534 in 2005 from 1,480 in 2004. There were 540 homicides in New York City last year, police said, the lowest total since 1963.

Police Commissioner Kelly Says Gun Crimes Need To Be A Priority

January 02, 2006
      Police Commissioner Ray Kelly said Sunday that he wants the nation to follow Mayor Michael Bloomberg's lead on tougher gun control laws.
      He says the mayor's pledge to push the issue could end up having a big effect on the city.
      "We have the toughest gun laws in the country right here in New York City, and I think they're eminently reasonable," said Kelly. "But, that's not the case in the rest of the country; about 90 percent of the guns used in crimes here come from out of state. So the mayor, I think, has laid down a marker and that he's willing to fight this fight not only in Albany, but in Washington. I think that's good news for all New Yorkers." ...


Criminal, gun control two different things
Times Union, December 31, 2005

     The governor's initiatives to rid our streets of illegal guns and harshly punish those who use guns in the commission of a crime are worthy of praise. These are common sense approaches to reducing crime. The National Rifle Association and its state affiliates have been pushing for this type of legislation for a long time. However, I disagree with the way these initiatives are being portrayed since they are not about "gun control," but are about "criminal control."
      First, get the illegal guns away from the criminals. Second, encourage and support the right of law-abiding citizens to own and carry concealed handguns for personal protection. New York needs to follow the lead of almost 40 other states in the nation that have "shall issue" laws that allow unrestricted concealed handguns carry.
      These states have overwhelmingly seen a reduction in violent crime following the passage of such laws. Required background checks, FBI finger printing, character references and training have prevented the "Wild West" scenarios that many had envisioned with civilians carrying concealed weapons.
      Most gun owners strongly support police efforts to rid the streets of illegal guns and to harshly punish those who use guns in committing crimes. At the same time, many people recognize the important and significant role that private gun ownership plays in the protection of law-abiding citizens.
      According to a study by Gary Kleck, a criminology professor at Florida State University, legal gun owners use a gun to protect themselves, family or property approximately 2.4 million times a year. This number is staggering. Unfortunately, the media neglect to report that guns save lives, and on a very significant scale each year. Police agencies and politicians alike have come to acknowledge the important role armed citizens play in the prevention of violent crime.
      So, yes, take the guns out of the hands of criminals. But don't deny or restrict the constitutional right of law-abiding citizens to carry and use firearms to protect themselves and their loved ones.

RTC letter in Buffalo News
Filed under: General, Politics — Jacob @ 10:38 am
From: Gun Legislation & Politics in New York

     The Buffalo News ran my letter today under the heading “State should permit citizens to carry concealed handguns.”

     I would like to comment on the Dec. 28 News editorial, “Credible action in Albany.” If the governor and State Legislature were serious about public safety, they would abolish the Sullivan Act and bring New York law in line with other states like Pennsylvania and Ohio, which allow ordinary people to carry a concealed handgun so they can protect themselves. The Wisconsin Legislature recently passed a bill with a veto-proof 2-1 majority that will soon make it the 39th state with such a law.
      Meanwhile, legislators in Albany continue to defy common sense by thinking that violent thugs with felony rap sheets a mile long will obey new tougher laws against “illegal” guns. Other states don’t export their guns to us. New York imports thugs from other states, who know liberals are working hard to perpetuate an environment where they can ply their trade with little fear of arrest and prosecution or of armed citizens exercising their right of self-defense.

RTC letter in Times Herald-Record
Filed under: General, Politics — Jacob @ 9:48 am

The Times Herald-Record printed my letter to the editor today under the heading “Right-to-carry law”.

With regard to your op-ed “Pataki gun plan bodes well for Newburgh,” if the governor and Legislature were serious, they would abolish the Sullivan Act and bring New York law in line with other states with right-to-carry concealed handgun laws so ordinary people can defend themselves.
      The Wisconsin legislature passed a bill with a veto-proof 2-1 majority that will soon make it the 39th state with just such a law. Meanwhile, liberals in Albany continue to defy common sense by thinking that violent thugs with felony rap sheets a mile long will obey new tougher laws against “illegal” guns in the state.
      Other states don’t export their guns to us. New York imports thugs from other states who know liberals are working hard to perpetuate an environment where they can ply their trade with little fear of arrest and prosecution or of an armed citizen exercising their right of self-defense.
      I sent similar letters to several papers and the Buffalo News called yesterday to verify it so I assume they will run it.


Gov. Mario Pataki calls Gov. Mario Pataki calls "Extraordinary Session" to pass gun control laws that punish criminals

     ON December 17, 2005, Gov. Mario Pataki called an "Extraordinary Session" of the state legislature and two bills were passed. The first was S50001, "AN ACT to amend the penal law, in relation to the possession and sale of firearms." The second was S50002 or the "crimes against police act" "Enacts the crimes against police act; establishes new crimes and penalties for people who commit certain crimes against peace officers or police officers; establishes the allowable sentences for such convictions, as well as convictions for murder in the first degree."
     These bills were supported by most gun owners but Sheldon Silver and the anti-gun extremist were not happy and planned to pass all of their extreme gun ban, rules and regulations as soon as the new legislative session starts.

The Illegal Firearms (Anti-Gun Trafficking) Bill:

Criminal Sale of Firearms S50001

  • The criminal sale of a weapon offenses are graded in the Penal Law by three degrees ranging in seriousness from a Class D felony to a Class B felony. The illegal sale of a single firearm is a Class D non-violent felony [Penal Law §265.11]; the illegal sale of 10 or more firearms is a Class C violent felony offense [Penal Law §265.12]; and the illegal sale of 20 or more firearms is a Class B violent felony offense [Penal Law §265.13].
  • The new law will amend these provisions by (1) classifying the Class D felony offense of the illegal sale of even one firearm as a violent felony offense; (2) punishing as a Class C violent felony the illegal sale of 5 or more firearms; and (3) punishing as a Class B violent felony the illegal sale of 10 or more firearms.

Criminal Possession of Multiple Firearms

  • Under current law, the criminal possession of a weapon is penalized by four offenses which range in seriousness from a Class A misdemeanor to a Class B felony. With respect to the illegal possession of multiple firearms, the Penal Law does not include similar gradations. The Penal Law [Penal Law 265.02(5)] sanctions the illegal possession of 20 or more firearms as a Class D violent felony offense punishable by a minimum determinate sentence of 2 years and a maximum of 7 years. An offender who possesses 19 or fewer firearms can be charged only with a mere Class A misdemeanor, punishable by up to a year in jail.
  • The new law will strengthen existing law by: 1) reducing from 20 to 3 the number of firearms required to be possessed for the Class D violent felony offense; 2) creating a new Class C violent felony offense for the illegal possession of 5 or more firearms [carrying a determinate sentence of at least 3 ½ years and up to 15 years]; and (3) creating a new Class B violent felony offense for the illegal possession of 10 or more firearms [carrying a determinate sentence of at least 5 years or up to 25 years].

Closing the Loophole

  • In addition, the new law recognizes the fact that gun traffickers often evade the strict felony penalties for multiple illegal sales by intentionally restricting the number of firearms that they sell in a single transaction.
  • This measure amends the law to eliminate this loophole by augmenting the "single transaction" standard with a one year rule. For example, under current law, a gun trafficker who illegally sells one gun each month over the course of a year could only be charged with a D non-violent felony for each of those transactions. Under the new law, the trafficker would be charged with a B violent felony offense.

The Crimes Against Police Act: S50002

  • The new law will toughen the minimum penalties for crimes committed against a police officer.
  • Murder of a Police Officer, Peace Officer or Corrections Employee: The new law guarantees Life Without Parole for the intentional murder of these law enforcement officers. When the sentencing judge does not opt for Life Without Parole, current law allows for a sentence of life, with a minimum of 20 - 25 years.
  • Attempted Murder 1 of a Police Officer, Peace Officer or Corrections Employee: Current law allows for a sentence of life, with a minimum of 15 - 25 years. The new law increases the minimums to 20- 40 to life.
  • Aggravated Assault of a Police Officer/Peace Officer: A B Violent Felony. Requires serious physical injury caused by a deadly weapon or dangerous instrument. Current law allows for a determinate sentence of between 5 - 25 years. The new law increases to between 10 - 30 years.
  • Attempted Aggravated Assault of a Police Officer/Peace Officer: A C violent felony. Current law allows for a determinate sentence of between 3 1/2 - 15 years. The new law increases to between 7 - 20 years.
  • Aggravated Manslaughter of a Police Officer/Peace Officer in the 1st and 2nd Degrees: The new law creates a new B Violent Felony crime for a defendant who, through an act of extreme emotional disturbance or with the intent to cause a police officer or peace officer serious physical injury, causes the death of such officer. Current law allows for a determinate sentence of between 5 - 25 years. The new law increases the minimum to between 10 - 30 years determinate. The new law also creates a new C Violent Felony crime for a defendant who recklessly causes the death of a police officer or peace officer. Current law allows for a sentence as low as probation, and no more than 5 – 15 indeterminate. The new law increases the minimum to between 7 - 20 years determinate.
  • Aggravated Criminally Negligent Homicide: The new law also creates a new D Violent Felony crime for a defendant who with criminal negligence causes the death of a police officer or peace officer. Current law allows for a sentence of straight probation. The new law increases a minimum determinate sentence of between 3 1/2 - 20 years.
  • Menacing of a Police Officer or Peace Officer: The new law creates a new D Violent Felony crime, similar to existing Menacing 2 involving menacing a police officer or peace officer with a deadly weapons, gun or knife, with a determinate sentence of between 2-8 years. A. Current law charges as an A misdemeanor w/ maximum sentence of up to 1 year.


NSSF holds Wingshooting USA's Dream Hunts Sweepstakes NSSF holds Wingshooting USA's Dream Hunts Sweepstakes

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